The Obama Kenya Thingy
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111111111111 THAT would be totally SWEET! To see the INS walk up to him at his headquarters, as he’s waiting the vote count, cuff him and perp walk his happy ass out to the same buss he’s thrown everyone else under. Oh! GOD! THAT would be good.
Drew - This is America - Stop listening to the msm and realize that anything can be done - And if this is true it needs to passed on and hounded on (as in people writing to their elected Representatives, local newspapers, Obama site, Obama rallies, Internet sites (we all don’t visit the same sites) etc. It is not the only one
I have not read the footnotes in this one to varify - of course I do find it a horrible commentary and sadden that the msm won’t even begin to even mention this, much less investigate it.
But here is another reason to drum this around and keep it going -
Read this carefully and be afraid - very afraid - they are planning to take America into socialism - and they lied to do it -
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20081011/D93OHKO80.html
If that alone does not make you want to vote for McCain - hell Ron Paul or even Cynthia McKinney rather than Obama - I do not know what will
The Dems have only 12 seats open (of course Kennedy won’t be a decent man and release his seat) but the Repubs have 23 seats - We need to make sure every single one goes to a Republican, Libertarian or Constitutionalist - (add it up 46 seats (and I don’t care how that is divided between the Senate and the House) it will make it safer even if Obama is elected.
cmblake6 gave us this link yesterday.
http://texasdarlin.wordpress.com/2008/10/11/obama-born-in-kenya-new-information/
From that link:
If he was born in Kenya, and his parents were Legally Married [which on the Preponderance of Evidence they were, his father’s first “Marriage” being a Tribal, or Village, Marriage, which was not Legally Recognized] due to the age of his mother he would NOT have been a US Citizen. The Immigration and Nationality Act 1952, 8 U.S.C. 1401. Sec. 301 (g) [Effective November 14, 1986] does not apply, nor does Title III, Immigration and Nationality Act Section 309. [8 U.S.C. 1409].
Unless he has taken the Oath of Allegiance as a Naturalized Citizen since he was 18 years old, and if he was born in Mombasa, Kenya, Barack Hussein Obama II would not be a US Citizen, period. The issue of whether or not he was Natural Born under Article II of the Constitution of the United States would cease to matter and he would need to be Deported as an Illegal Alien.
Impeachment as a Senator would seem not to be necessary since he would never Legally have been one, but Diane Feinstein and the members of the Senate Ethics and Rules Committee would be liable to Impeachment. So would their opposite numbers in the Illinois Senate and the appropriate officials of the Illinois State Supreme Court and Bar, so far as I can see.
Further:
In that event the Senate Ethics and Rules Committee, Chair Diane Feinstein, have a problem because they are responsible for the Certification of a Candidate’s Compliance with Constitutional Requirements, a job they would have conspicuously failed to do. Should he be Elected the poisoned Chalice would pass to Nancy Pelosi because as Speaker of the House she, and the House, have the Responsibility to ensure that the President Elect can Effectively be Sworn In and Legally Assume the Office and Duties of the President.
While I hope it is true, I’m not banking on it. Though it fits with the B. Hussein Obama playbook. Obscure everything.
Example:
We know from both the MSM and Obama’s own statements that he attended Trinity United Church of Christ for 20 years. What we don’t know is this:
What mosque did he attend before that?
I’m sorry, but at the very least, this is a utterly WEAK attack. Is Obama’s behaviour odd? Yes. But consider: he has released his birth certificate TWICE, which is good enough to get a passport virtually any day of the week. In addition, this is perhaps the ONLY time I’ve seem we NeoKons line up with a 9/11 truther. The man involved (Berg) is a certified Truther, and has a history of ill-founded lawsuits against politicians in the past.
And if anything here does pan out? Does anyone REALLY think that Obama will be dropped from the race? More likely, he will have a quick shoot through naturalization before he is sworn in.
We have vastly more valuable efforts with which to dedicate our resources and time on.
Posted by Turtler
10/13/2008 at 07:40 PM
But that’s the whole point Turtler. If he has to have a quick shoot through naturalization, then he was never eligible to run for President in the first place. Immigrants are not allowed to run for the office. Period. Says so right in the Constitution. And if somebody needs naturalizing, then by definition they are an immigrant.
The laws on the books at the time took a very conservative view of citizen’s rights, including the built-in ability to pass the right of citizenship on to your progeny. Since the age of maturity was 21 at the time, and minors under that age were considered (and still are actually) “infants in the eyes of the law”, then they have less rights, because they aren’t quite full citizens yet. They are children, under the protection of someone else. So had the ObamaMama been knocked up at 17, not gotten married, and had the baby anywhere in the world, that child would have automatically been an American citizen, because that path of action would be something legally akin to being a declared emancipated minor. But since she was married that clause didn’t apply ... and even though she was married, the laws on the books back then still didn’t see her, a teenager, as a fully rights-invested adult. Had she married an adult American, there would not have been a problem with the baby’s citizenship, because the baby would be the child of one full citizen, ie the father. She falls into a gray area. That this was a bigamist marriage for Barack Senior doesn’t matter either, probably, since it is legally fine for muslim Kenyans to have multiple wives.
These laws have since been amended, but the other side of the No Ex-Post Facto rule is that you can’t benefit from laws written after your event occurs. Her situation has to be examined by the laws that were in place at the time. And the law in place at the time says that a baby born oversees is automatically a citizen IF and ONLY IF one of the parents is an American citizen and had been an American citizen for at least 5 years since they were 14. 14+5=19, 19 > 18. She was 18, just barely, but 18 nonetheless, when Obama was born. Citizenship is not automatically granted, and her baby is a foreigner. There were good reasons to amend that law, and this is one of them. But it was the law at the time, period.
If it can be shown - proven, to the satisfaction of experts - that he was born in Hawaii, then this whole thing is moot. But there does appear to be strong evidence that he was born in Kenya, which would actually have made him a citizen of the UK. Little stuff like his whole african side of his family saying so, along with birth records from the hospital there. Maybe someone should root around under the bus and ask his granny. But she might not actually know the true answer to the question. Daughter’s passport ought to show entry and exit dates for Kenya and the USA, but it’s a good bet that said passport is long since lost. And if it were suddenly found, such marks would be suspect at this late date.
The whole Indonesian adoption thing, his name being changed to Barry Soeto, doesn’t matter really, because he was a minor at the time and the decision was made for him. At his maturity he would have had to declare his natural born American citizenship (if he was Hawaiin born) (because Indonesia only allowed adoption of Indonesians, and to this day does not allow dual citizenship) or apply for it if he was Kenyan born. What I’ve read is that at his maturity he let his Kenyan citizenship lapse ... which could be further implication that he was actually born there. Otherwise Obama grew up actually being a citizen of 3 nations: the USA, Kenya, and Indonesia?? I’m not sure such a thing is possible.
The birth certificate released to the internet was shown to be a phony. If that instance is one of your twices, then that one doesn’t count.
I can guarantee that this will be swept under the rug though, even if the whacko Berg is actually on target for once.
But that’s the whole point Turtler. If he has to have a quick shoot through naturalization, then he was never eligible to run for President in the first place. Immigrants are not allowed to run for the office. Period. Says so right in the Constitution. And if somebody needs naturalizing, then by definition they are an immigrant.
And the problem is that you don’t realize that, while that is the law dejure and defacto, it is already too late in the game to hope it has much effect. Do you realize what would happen if Obama would be disqualified now or, god forbid, AFTER winning the presidency? All hell would break loose with wild conspiracy theories about the “Neocon Cabal” and would practically MANDATE that such a compromise would happen, because, after all the Obama backers would say, has Obama not lived in this country almost continuously since he ceased living abroad?
You can quote all the law you want, and I wholeheartedly agree that this is the case and that if McCain actually was not an American citizen, his run would have ended before it began (which actually might not have been such a bad thing, as it might have forced one of our previous false hopes to fight this fight instead of the RINO in chief).
But you must deal with life in practical terms. And those practical terms are more or less set that the ONLY way we would be able to find enough time to get Obama’s birth certificate open is by defeating him in the election. That is the sad truth.
And following this up is hardly a wise use or resources right now, when we all need to focus on the ONLY fight that matters. The fact remains that their is no way in hell this country would disenfranchise half the electoral base (or so they thing) and their votes by disallowing Obama AFTER he wins. So he must be beaten and THEN investigated.
And the fact remains that we have many other, stronger leads in this case: Ayers, the Chicago Machine, ACORN, all of these are targets that will almost certainly help us in the fight that counts: at the ballot box.
But there does appear to be strong evidence that he was born in Kenya
And there is equally as strong evidence that he was born in Hawaii: someone (one of our own in the Islands) actually tracked down the newspaper from 40+ years ago and managed to find his name and those of his family there in the archives. FORTY YEARS AGO! Yes, it could be forged. But it would have taken god-knows-how-long to make convincing, and the fact remains that we also have other people stating he was born in Hawaii. Which is about as strong a case as the Kenyan and Indonesian theories.
which would actually have made him a citizen of the UK.
Got, don’t tell Pieper about that possibility. He will absolutely FLIP.
On a different note, it is more likely that his British citizenship would have been turned to Kenyan following the compromises the British made after stomping out the Mau Mau Revolt.
Little stuff like his whole african side of his family saying so, along with birth records from the hospital there.
Which is roughly as strong as the records in Hawaii and the eye-witness accounts there. The simple fact is that WE ARE REACHING FAR and most of the public is willing to take his word on that. Including me, if only as a working theory I use in discussions regarding him.
I don’t like this ANY more than you do, and probably considerably less. But the fact remains that our Loo-loo friend Berg is not sufficient to make this case, and even if it WERE to turn out that he was born in Kenya or an Indonesian Citizen or WHATEVER, if he wins, it won’t matter. The political realities of this country will FORCE a compromise that will allow him to ascend to the Oval Office.
So, even if this is true, we have precious few resources and little time that could be better served elsewhere. Berg is simply difficult to find credible to a great many people given his 9/11 Truther credentials and past frivolous lawsuits. Our cause, INCLUDING the cause of getting to the bottom of this, are better served by making sure he does not win the presidency. And that means we have to pick and choose targets that we can effectively hit on a solid basis. And this is not solid. Far from it.
I don’t like this any more than you, but if we want to win, we have to choose our battles.
Posted by Turtler
10/13/2008 at 09:35 PM
Yes, what you say is exactly the point of my entire post: it won’t matter, even if it is true. It’s too late to do anything about it. You can’t pull him out of the race now, and if he gets elected, he’s the Prez. Otherwise the country would go apeshit.
Yep, that’s what I wrote.
Best to not elect him. Best also to choose our battles, as you say, which was what my post was implying; this one isn’t worth it.
I think you guys miss the big picture here a bit. Yes its likely this is vapor and yes its a waste of words to over analize and emphasize it but it does have value in the same way all the palin dreck has value on the other side. It sows the seeds of doubt about the man and lame as it may be a meme spread large is a meme remembered. Considering the piety of the left as to truth I see no harm in letting this meme spread as far as it can.Besides,It makes libs I bump into go batsh_t at the mere mention.
I agree that it has value, but it’s several steps down from being the value we wish it had.
The value is that it points up how unacceptable it is to have a candidate spend months deliberately obscuring and hiding his records. And the only way to properly drive that point home is to insist that no, if he was born in Kenya, it’s too late to fix it now, he’s off the ballot.
I need say no more. True or not, the rumor helps our cause. It adds to the seeds of doubt sprouting through the nation. This particular left wing communist POS has no business in our government ANYWAY, and whatever we can do to reinforce that within the public is fair. How much excrement have they tossed in our direction? What’s good for the whatever is good for the other. We’re above that sort of thing? Is it worth it to hold your head high as you march off to the re-education camp? Didn’t think so.
Turtler I´m sorry but it does matter ! I agree with you that there is strong and even conclusive evidence he was born in Hawaii (and I am pretty sure he was because the GOP, FBI and CIA have looked in this). But if by any chance he is not elegible he should be thrown out of office.
Posted by JustDude
10/18/2008 at 10:21 AM
JustDude: See my response to Drew. As you said, there is strong evidence that he was born in Hawaii. Honestly, this seems like a desire for an easy-out, a “Magic Bullet” to destroy the Obama Campaign. And, honestly, I can sympathize. HOWEVER, the fact is that it is too late for it to have pretty much ANY effect on the situation. If it WERE to turn out that Obama is not a citizen, he has reached the level of popularity where there would be some compromise deal brokered to allow him in IF he wins.
So, while this “Magic Bullet” is attractive to many from a stressed base, it is likely a dud bullet, even if it has any substance at all. Better to concentrate our time and resources on other, CONCRETE venues. Once Obama is beaten, then we MAY have the luxury of looking in. But certainly not until then.
Rick K: This logic is both morally reprehensible and inherently unsound: for one, is the entire point not to be one step above one’s enemies? The moral highground is not a figment of one’s imagination and is worth holding because of what it is. Secondly, THIS makes no sense whatsoever:
“I see no harm”
NEWSFLASH: If it is not true (and it likely not) then the enemy (who, unlike us, have control of the media) WILL rake us over hot coals for this and use it to sap our credibility.
We have to pick our fights WISELY if we want to win this.
Posted by Turtler
10/18/2008 at 08:20 PM
Enough. RightWingNews had this on the 14th.
http://rightwingnews.com/mt331/2008/10/barack_obama_is_an_american_ci.php
Hell,I thought this thread died 4 days ago but I guess not in turtlers mind. I dont remember offering to spread it but just allowing it to go where it wanted to go. But if that makes me morally inferior then what can I say,meh.
"Hell,I thought this thread died 4 days ago but I guess not in turtlers mind”
Make that in JustDude’s mind. I was responding to him.
“I dont remember offering to spread it but just allowing it to go where it wanted to go.”
And pray tell me how many on the Left hold that idea? They aren’t responsible for what their well-meaning but Radical members say about the GOP, and they won’t directly pass on the innocent misinformation about the Rethuglikans (who, by the way, are so dirty and EEEVIILL that a few small pieces of misinformation won’t make a difference), but they will not step in to stop something that is patently wrong. Because it is about the EEEVVIILL GOP, after all.
I, for one, am sick of this mentality.
The entire point is to stand above your opponents. You sometimes have to get your hands dirty, that is true. But why descend to their level when there is nothing down there but a void of hate? And even if you don’t mind wallowing in the swill the Kossacks, DUmmies, and their ilk shower in, why would you do so for a case that is likely not going to go anywhere, given the poor quality of evidence?
Posted by Turtler
10/19/2008 at 02:03 AM
And what about Sam Wurzelbach? You know, “Joe the Plumber”? The guy that’s getting raped because he dared question “TEH MESSIAH”? What about him and what the O
samabamalytes are doing to him? Does anyone disagree with the idea that if these bastards are doing that to him, anything we can do is any worse? This miserable odor component of a livestock feedyard must NEVER reach the Whitehouse.I surrender to the piety of your convictions Turtler. Now see if Mr Berg shares your thoughts on the subject as he actually made a case that was accepted by a legitimate court.And that has yet to be dismissed by that same court as frivolous or without merit*.Im just sayin.
* Im assuming this is still the situation.
